What can be expected from each? Job wise. Even though I'll still be a non-rate what would I be considered?

Seaman if you are on deck crew on a ship.
Fireman if you are in the engineering department on a ship.
Airmen are only those in the 4 month program prior to an A school. I don't believe anyone leaves boot camp as an airman.

Seaman - chipping, sanding, painting, cleaning, mess cooking.
Fireman - engine room work, I have only been personally linked to Seaman so I don't know specifics for a Frieman.
Airman - In your 4 month training time prior to a school.

Fireman - you will clean oil out of bilges, help with oil changes, gear oil changes, do engineering rounds while underway, probably stand engineering watches on large cutters, do basic repair around the station (if you're at a small boat station), anything that has to do with an engine you might do.

Do fireman do mess cooking or is that a seaman thing??? I'm really not sure. I know Colin has done more than his fair share... Don't know if the FN's take a turn.

Yes, FNs are included in the mess cooking rotation.

Mess cooking.....yup, plenty of that too!

Posted By Old Guard2 on 27 Nov 2011 04:06 PM

Fireman - engine room work, I have only been personally linked to Seaman so I don't know specifics for a Frieman.

Frieman - cleans, maintains, and empties/fills the deep fryer; cooks steak, curly, skinny, and sweet potato fries to a crisp bite. also deep fries mozzarella sticks, jalapeno poppers, hashbrown patties, and other types of snacks.

=)

Thanks for all the great info. Now do you request either seaman or fireman when you put in for location on your dream sheet?

You don't. The CG makes that first decision for you based on the unit you go to and what they need. 10 people from your company can all go to the Morgenthau... 5 will be Seaman, 5 will be Fireman... that will be determined by what billet you are filling. It is one of the few times the CG actually dictates what you do. But that in no way has any bearing on what A school you can attend. So if you gat an FN billet, don't think that means you have to go DC or MK or something like that. You can still go for AET if that is your desire. Same if you get an SN position but truly want to be in an engine room, not a problem at all!

So when I arrive at my first duty station they will fill me in on what I'll be doing?

My title would be something like FN Bond?

yes, FA or FN depending on if you go in as an E2 or E3 but you would be referred to as Fireman or Seaman Bond.

Each duty station will have different expectations for a nonrate. At one station you could be working the deck where other units you are sweeping and doing something less fun.

I signed for 6 years so I'll go into basic as an E-3. FA = fireman E-2 and FA = E-3?

FA/SA = fireman/seaman apprentice (E2), FN/SN = fireman/seaman (E3)

Wow that was simple. Thank you for clearing that up. What about switching from a FN to SN or vice versed. Can you be switched based on the demand needed at that unit or can you somehow asked to be changed. Personally since I'm a gear head I'd rather be a FN then a SN.

needs of the unit. It is possible to switch but they dont have to let you switch.

Oh Jersey, when Gears sees the post that you are a gearhead, you are going to be his new favorite. LOL

You can request it on your dream sheet. My husband really wanted to be a FN on a medium-endurance cutter. That's what he wrote in the comments section on his dream sheet. He got exactly what he wanted, but it was likely just luck...others don't get exactly what they want. On my husband's cutter, you can request to work with a rate you're interested in after you get qualified. So, if you think you'd like to be an EM, you can request to work with an EM. So, even if you're a SN, you can spend one day a week shadowing an EM (provided that the workload in the deck department allows it). This usually only happens in port. I'm not sure about switching between SN and FN...I haven't known anyone that has done that. Like previous people have said though, even if you're an SN, you can still pursue MK or DC or EM A-school.

Another wrench turner on the board?? Really?

Old Guard 2: guessing you know gears pretty well?
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Oh yea! I've been at it since I was 7 years old and have no plan of stopping any time soon. Of the 2 4x4's I've owned and my high school project, none of them staid close to factory for long.
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Janelleyfish: thanks for all the great info!

Gears is a bit of a legend around here... We all love him! LOL

Old Guard loves me.. Everyone else.. they are entitled to their opinions..

You have to potential to be a great MK then.. If you have any questions, feel free.

Come on Gears you know how I feel about you...

oh haha guess that show how new i am to the forum.

There's that and the 19 posts you've accrued so far.

Don't forget duty at a boat station. As a Seaman you'll eventually qualify as boat crew on a 25 RB-S and probably also on a 45 RB-M and maybe on a 41' UTB (if there are any left when you get there). In 6 years you'll likely qualify as Coxswain and maybe as a Boarding Officer (law enforcement) and you may start down the road of some other specialized training. As a Fireman you learn mechanical stuff and you'll be the one that keeps the jet drives clear on the 45 or helps (with supervision) change out the lower ends on the Honda outboards on the 25's and if you work on a 41' UTB you'll become very familiar with the cummins 903 turbo diesel and a million other things. If you continue on that track you'll advance to MK. I believe the MK's on small boats also often qualify as Boarding Officers and perhaps as Coxswains (although that might not work that way). BM's also can qualify and board to become OOD's at stations. I'm not sure MK's do.

the first time i went to cape may i got to talk to a crew on a 47' mlb and right then and there i wanted to start tinkering with those 2 diesels. assuming one of the guys was an MK right???

what needs to be done to be qualified as a heavy weather coxswain? and a surface swimmer?

again the 47'ers really interested me and getting stationed somewhere where i was part of the 4 man crew would be a dream.

Let me clarify a few things about Small Boat Stations...

Stations come in a variety of flavors.. Heavy WX, Surf, and Regular.. with a variety of boats, usually in a combination of 2 or more. 41's, 45's, 47's, 25's to name a few. There is no formula for getting assigned to one unit vs another. You put in your request, and about a week later you get orders. End of story..

As a SN or FN at a small boat station you will have to qualify as boat crew on the standard boats at the unit, FN have the added bonus of becoming Engineer Qualified on the platforms that require them. At the Station where I spent 4 years all Non Rates had to qualify as Boarding Team Members and all Petty Officers (BMs and MKs) had to be Boarding Officer qualified. The BMs at the unit all had to be Cox'n qualified on each standard platform, and all of the rated Petty Officers (BMs and MKs had to qualify as OODs (Officer of the Day) for the Sta. Being a SN or FN at any unit doesn't pigeon hole you into a rate. I know FN who started off scrubbing bilges with me who are cooks now, and SN who saw the light and became MKs.

As far as crew make up.. the 4 person crew is a typical boat crew, each small boat station is made up of enough personnel to keep the unit fully operational. Even if you went to a Sta you won't be assigned to a specific 4 person crew. You'll learn to work within the entire unit and break down into crews as necessary.

MKs can become Cox'n qualified, it's rare because most training hours for Cox'n are dedicated to the BMs and BM strikers.

Any questions?

:o let me read this a few more times so I soak it all in. Sound like you really know what's going on in the CG community. Wow

Posted By Gears on 30 Nov 2011 05:38 PM
Let me clarify a few things about Small Boat Stations...

Stations come in a variety of flavors.. Heavy WX, Surf, and Regular.. with a variety of boats, usually in a combination of 2 or more. 41's, 45's, 47's, 25's to name a few. There is no formula for getting assigned to one unit vs another. You put in your request, and about a week later you get orders. End of story..

As a SN or FN at a small boat station you will have to qualify as boat crew on the standard boats at the unit, FN have the added bonus of becoming Engineer Qualified on the platforms that require them. At the Station where I spent 4 years all Non Rates had to qualify as Boarding Team Members and all Petty Officers (BMs and MKs) had to be Boarding Officer qualified. The BMs at the unit all had to be Cox'n qualified on each standard platform, and all of the rated Petty Officers (BMs and MKs had to qualify as OODs (Officer of the Day) for the Sta. Being a SN or FN at any unit doesn't pigeon hole you into a rate. I know FN who started off scrubbing bilges with me who are cooks now, and SN who saw the light and became MKs.

As far as crew make up.. the 4 person crew is a typical boat crew, each small boat station is made up of enough personnel to keep the unit fully operational. Even if you went to a Sta you won't be assigned to a specific 4 person crew. You'll learn to work within the entire unit and break down into crews as necessary.

MKs can become Cox'n qualified, it's rare because most training hours for Cox'n are dedicated to the BMs and BM strikers.

Any questions?

Pretty sure I have you understood. Does your crew change day to day based on who is scheduled to work and the rates needed to construct a full crew on that individual boat? Also if I wanted to get qualified as a coxswain would I be able to work out a schedule somehow to fit this in? I was talking to a guy stationed at cape may and he said the more stuff you get qualified for the better. How true is this?

I thought that getting qualified as a surface swimmer and a heavy weather coxswain might benefit me

I was a fireman for 7 months then switched to seaman to finish striking BM.

To switch, a deckie had to want to go fireman, she did when she got here but I had to wait 4 months before I could switch, and until half my BM packet was signed.

Seaman aren't going to get coxn qualed. A SNBM can, but they aren't going to invest that much time into a seaman to get a coxn qual. A crewman qual takes long enough.

Surface cutter swimmer is a PQS that outlines alot of first aid/ SAR techniques and then physical tasking requirements, like pushups, situps, a run and swim. A nonrate can become a surface cutter swimmer.

Like Gears said, there are different types of stations, and the BMs will get qualified in different levels of Coxn. Most of the Heavy Weather stations are on the West Coast and then mostly in the North West. Surf stations are the same, mostly in the north west. It is also easier to get qualified in the north west compared to Cali because the waves are more frequent and training is easier to achieve.

There is the Prosepctive Surfsman Program, which BMs can apply for when they are putting in their picks for transfer season, or if there is critical need for them. A BM would report and then start training for Crewman, Coxn, Heavy Weather Coxn then Surfsman, at the station and at c-school. To do the program you need a command endorsement. The whole thing takes about 6 years; and once you are a surfsman it is very hard to get out of that career path since they are so few and far in between.

The PQS and boards for Coxn is no joke and pretty intense. The other SNBM at my unit, a cutter, the biggest one, got qualified because 1. it was good timing, our 2 bm3s were leaving and that would have left one coxn at the unit (a bm2), and 2 he works his a** off and knows his sh*t. Otherwise I've never heard of another snbm getting coxn qualed.

You need to make Coxn or Underway OOD to make BM2. So, chances are, you are probably going to be a 3rd for a while regarless of how fast you do your other BM2 pracs/pass your EOCT.

In bootcamp I picked fireman, I knew i was going to strike BM but I wanted some engineering experince anyway. It worked out for me that I finished striking within a year, the other SNBM was also a fireman and switched to deck alot quicker than I did and therefore finshed striking a lot faster also. Within 6 months he finished striking, within a year and a half he made coxn, and within 2 years he'll make 3rd.

If you want to go BM I would strike. I would only go to a-school if you end up at a unit that isn't very striker friendly. A-school will be faster, but comparing the strikers to the a-schoolers as far as BM knowledge goes, the strikers know hands down better and know how to run a deck. A-school will just feed you what you need to know to pass your tests but as far as hands-on experience and knowledge, striking is the way to go.

Just my opinion

Also, as a BM, I am trying for a buoy tender as my next unit (as a bm3), its hard to get into ATON as a 2nd, but not hard to start the surfsman program as a 2nd. So, I am going to have a go at some Buoy Tending and then if I don't like it try a heavy weather station and then if I like that put in for the surfsman program. My bosn has done both, loved both, but says surfsman just wears on your body to much. He is going to retire after one more ATON unit after have about equal amount of time doing both (will be 30 years in).